Recently while I was reading a post on SEOmoz, I started to think about the SEOmoz users and the whole points system. I read one of Lindsay’s Twitter posts saying that the MozPoint distribution system on SEOmoz is a case study in itself. I thought it might be a cool thing for all the users and SEOmoz staff to look at.
I created a crawler/scraper that went through the rankings and collected all the necessary information I needed to get some statistics. Below are some statistics that I found interesting and noteworthy.
DISCLAIMER:
I’m not trying to slam “Non-Pro Members” and I understand there could be a large number of spam users that have only posted once, get thumbs down, and are throwing the stats off. So take these statistics with a grain of salt.
- “Pro Members” have an average of 44 points
- “Non-Pro Members” only have an average of 10 points.
- 18.6% of registered SEOmoz users are “Pro Members.”
- Only 9.5% of “Pro Members” have reached the 100 point mark to remove the nofollow on their profile link.
- Only 3.36% of all SEOmoz users have reached the 100 point mark to remove the nofollow on their profile link.
- Only 12.3% of all SEOmoz users have posted 10 or more comments.
- 43% of all SEOmoz users have more than 1 point.
- Only 4.8% of all SEOmoz users have had a YOUmoz posts published.
- Of the 846 total YOUmoz posts written, they were written by only 336 users.
- To be in the top 95% of all SEOmoz users you only need to have 52 points.
- Rand has earned 8.8% of the total points 153,262 points in the SEOmoz world.
- SEOmoz Staff/Associates have earned over 25% of the 153,262 points in the SEOmoz world.
- The top 1.5% of SEOmoz user has earned over 62% of the total SEOmoz points.
So what can we the user and SEOmoz learn and take away from these statistics? Below are my questions that I formed from looking at the statistics:
- What can SEOmoz do to increase user participation in the blog?
- Does SEOmoz want to increase the participation in the blogs or stick to increasing “Pro Members” and coming up with new tools?
- What are some of the ramifications of an increase in comments and submissions to the YOUmoz and the main blog, besides Rebecca having a meltdown?
- What’s holding back users from commenting and contributing to the community?
I’m going to end this post here so everyone can post their comments and questions they have about my statistics. If anyone is interested in having the complete data, please feel free to PM me and I will send the Excel file your way.
There have been a few posts about the thumbing system and a variety of statistics and I think this one is the best.
First, it provides a great deal of top level data that gives the community an opportunity to synthesize their invididual opinions, which is, I think, one of the most important elements of a good post - to elicit thoughts and ideas.
Having been a frequent commenter, I'm not surprised by the significant skew of the top 1.5% What I think would be more interesting to analyze is the next level of contributors (less the 1.5%), because in my opinion that group probably represents more of the core of the SEOmoz community.
I mentioned this once before, but for what it's worth, the majority of my commenting came during a period of time that I went through a divorce and pulled back quite a bit from my consulting business to spend time with my kids. It also gave me a lot of free time (clearly), while they were at school or with their mom, to participate in this forum and it actually gave me a great vehicle to learn, laugh, joke around and make new friends during a difficult period in my life. Very good therapy and I highyl recommend it. :)
One thing that I will say is a disappointment is that despite the vast amount of contribution the youmoz members have made to this site, is that it has been done with little to no reward. From that perspective, I think the members have been taken for granted.
I've read several times over the months - and again here with a comment from Rebecca, that they've been talking about ways to improve Youmoz and will be rolling some new things out soon. I hope that's the case, and I hope the ideas truly reflect an appreciation for the community and the investment of their time in making it a strong one.
To be candid, I'm not really looking for anything myself. When I was contributng heavily, I was typically getting a free month's worth of Pro membership on a consistent basis - a dubious distinction for sure (eg. get a life dude). I also benefitted from a year memebership given to me by another generous member, Paul (aka credopaul) who had won several annual memberships from a landing page contest.
Separately, I won two little mini constests, each of which were for some SEOmoz schwag, and in each case - SEOmoz failed to deliver - even though they were aware of it.
I'm not complaining, because I really don't need or care about getting an SEOmoz t-shirt, sweatshirt, etc., but I make the point because I think it's symptomatic that SEOmoz really has not shown by it's actions, much interest in thanking the community for their contirbutions. I know there's some appreciation there, but it's really not shown in a tangible manner.
My personal feeling is that the metrics you have painstakingly prepared somehwat demonstrate one of the byproducts of that lack of appreciation.
I realize that not all Moz members are contributing in the manner they do because of a lack of incentive or appreciation for their efforts, but the participation would certainly rise if there was some meat in a program to entice them to participate more - and in a more meaningful and quality manner. It seems that SEOmoz has kind of stuck with the common big blog mantra of "we provide you a vehicle to get yourself in front of a larger audience while you build your own blog, etc." There's certainly some value in that, but it's not really enough to motivate people to build Youmoz beyond what it is today.
All that said - what I enjoy is the community members themselves, and despite the fact that I've shifted for the time being to a non-search related endeavor (outside the occasional consulting gig), I find myslef coming back to the neighborhood to see what everyone's up to.
Sean,
I love your perspectives. I've learned more from your comments and contributions than from any othermember here. Seriously, thanks!
You never received your goodies for winning those contests? :(
That is really bothering me - I'll ask Christine & Arden to look into it. I remember the email threads on this topic.... Sorry about that, Sean.
Before I read your post, I was looking at my Moz Points (55) and my ranking (350) and wondering what influenced them. Very cool!
I listen to a lot of talk radio, and one of the local AM guys in my area was talking about incentives the other night - he visited a class of students at Syracuse University and gave a lecture, and afterwards, the professor told the class that they would recieve an incentive if they listened to this guy's broadcast that evening and called in to comment. Had he not given an incentive, the professor predicted that 1 student would call. With the incentive, he thought that as many as 15 would call. 2 called - so, the professor was right. Incentives work.
Ideally, people would comment on blog posts here because they had questions, or thoughts, without the allure of an incentives...but Fabio is right...I bet more people would comment if they had some kind of additional motivation.
As a recent first-time YOUmoz poster...I'm surprised that only 4.8% have submitted and posted. That's disappointing to me!
Thanks, incentives are the way to go for sure. The other thing that throws the stats off are the fact that members with 0 points do not show up in the list. So that could throw a wrench into the numbers. Enjoyed your first post the other day, keep it up!
Great post chenry, once again, I really like your post.
There are several factor that come to my mind regarding the less activities on Youmoz blog and SEomoz oparticipation overall.
External Factor:
Internal Factor :
What’s holding back users from commenting and contributing to the community?
- asking questions in previous comments that remain unanswered
- never receiving a thumb up for previous comments
- reading a post days after it was published and thinking the comment will never be read
- shiness
- english deficiency
- blondes that still don't have their dedicated keyboard
Some people prefer to work rather than talk :) just kidding ...
I'd say most people come here to check the tools and read the news or some other interesting stuff. If you come here to check the tools it means that you need to analyse something...basically you're working and if/when you work you don't quite fancy to write replies or you just don't have the time to do it. Just my 2c ...
Been a member for quite a while here and this is my first comment ...do I get 1 point for that? :) kidding again
I think my biggest question with the points system is why the staff and affiliates of SEOMoz are receiving points? I think it's great when they post and comment, but should they be receiving points for it?
It's just a thought that has popped into my head recently. What benefit is there for them to be getting points and being ranked in the list? Isn't it kind of skewing the rankings when someone is being compared to Rand who without a doubt is going to have the most points because he's obviously been around the longest (being that he's one of the founders of the company).
Just a thought.
It's important for the staff to have points IMHO. It shows exactly how much they contribute to their own product and reassures new readers that they will indeed be interacted with by the staff.
It's not skweing the list, so much as it is accurately demonstrating the level of participation of the staffers. In the end, the staff are also members of the SEOmoz community just like the regular members. The fact that they are paid to work there shouldn't eliminate them from inclusion in their own community. Also, I would have to imagine that the point system is also a good motivator for getting new hires to participate more . . .
Ok, I guess I can go along with that line of thinking. However, couldn't there be a different system for them? Maybe I'm just overthinking it though. It does make sense if that's the reasoning behind it.
The difference is built into their Avatars so everyone can see that there is some skew associated with the number of points they have because of their "SEOMOZ STAFF" or "SEOMOZ ASSOCIATE" header. Seems to be a reasonable way to differentiate the points they've earned to me.
We have talked about removing ourselves from the Top Mozpoints Earners list, so it definitely might happen soon. It's just that we're working on a lot of stuff, so little housekeeping items like that take lower priority.
Not that I don't love you guys, but I've often had that same thought - why not keep letting you get points, but give the staff it's own roster and let the Top X list be just community members. Especially as the Moz staff grows, it becomes more of a consideration. If the whole Top 20 ends up being Moz workers, it tends to disincent the users.
Oh, and I just noticed that Will passed me again in the rankings, so I suddenly got another idea - SEOmoz partners should also be separated out. Maybe they should have their own list, and it should be linked from the bottom of the sitemap in a 6-point font, preferably with a CAPTCHA you have to fill out ;)
The reason I contribute to YOUmoz and write comments is fairly simple. I think SEOmoz rocks. Even without the PRO stuff they give so much to the SEO community. I want to be part of that if I can. I would encourage others to contribute by participating in comments and writing YOUmoz posts.
If you have never written for YOUmoz here are a few tips
- Don't write a post that basically serves to promote your services. These tend not to go down very well.
- If you make statements as though they are fact be prepared to back them up with evidence.
- Don't take people's comments to heart. Try to reply in a positive way regardless of how stupid you think they are.
- If you can, include a but of humour in your posts - this appeals to many mozzers.
You are a superfreak like @seanmaguire, you've earned all your points in >5 months, good work! I comment much less frequently now, but I still appreciate the interaction here. Just have much less time for reading & interacting myself . . . actually a good thing. Anyway, interesting stats. It would be interesting to see some sort of graph showing participation levels of individual SEOmoz accounts over time, would be quite telling I'm sure.
I don't know if this is interesting to anyone other than me, but here are my mozPoints graphed over time.
https://www.dannydover.com/seomoz/mozPoints.png
This is the by-product of a side project I was working on.
Spreadsheet available on request ;-)
How often did you update your graph? Daily? Weekly?
Daily for 8 months.
I unintentionally killed this project when I 301ed my normal profile page to my staff profile. That was for a personal branding experiment I am running in Google. As soon as I finish this, I plan to share my results with everyone in a blog post.
BTW, thanks for the interesting post. I was particularly happy to see:
18.6% of registered SEOmoz users are “Pro Members.”
43% of all SEOmoz users have more than 1 point.
Cheers,
Danny
Cool, I can't wait for the post. Really, I bet your Pro Members are higher but members with 0 comments do not show up in the rankings.
What I found the most interesting is that "43% of all SEOmoz users have 1 or more points." Does that really mean that 57% of all SEOmoz users have 0 (ZERO) points?
Well that really means that I just earned more points in this comment then 57% of all SEOmozers have ever earned!
Actually I just checked and...
Thanks for participating JohnyX.
Realicity,
I actually was incorrect in that bullet. It should read the following:
I've contacted Rebecca to fix this. Sorry about that and thanks for bringing it up.
i think it has to do with not wanting go out on a limb and be wrong, or have people you respect disagree with you and call you out for the world to see. For me just recently joining and being fairly new to the industry you want to learn and observe as much as possible. Its like walking up to the cool table and trying to jump into the conversation. In a way its like what most of probably tell our clients about Social Media optimization, you are best served to enter conversations to improve and or add valuable content.
ditto. Also, SEOMoz blog entries are pretty darn complete (unline some other SEO blogs). I ofetn find I actually don't have questions because your stuff in very well thought out, documented (researched), and well written.
The distirbution of points looks like percentages of people that pay taxes.
1.5% of the SEOmoz uses earned over 62% of the total SEOmoz points is pretty close to the tax burden.
Regarding YOUmoz: we've had some meetings about how to improve it and hope to roll some ideas out within the month. Stay tuned!
How about send us all out doughnuts so we can take a tea-break, read YOUmoz and stick around to consider our comments ...
Bring on the doughnuts!
Great Post!
I think this is not only a SEOmoz problem. Many users don't comment about what they read, do not interact with the author or other users, they just read.
The only way that I know that works is using anything as reward. Something like "If you get 100 points in one month, you get access to some tools", or "You can download an e-book if you get 100 points this month".
Maybe trying somethink like this will increase blog comments.
I agree with Fabio. Some ideas like this can create better involvement among the members to take part in the discussions and write their comments. But there is already one advantage for pro-members active in seomoz. It is, for 150 points in a month, the pro members can access seomoz free for that month.
I wish i could partecipate more in the conversation but i'm not confident in my english so my main goal is to leave some very basic comments trying to be helpful (when i can) and in the same time trying to avoid mistakes.
Maing, your english seems pretty good to me. If that's all that's stopping you, comment as much as you want. I'm unilingual and not proud of it, so if anyone gives you crap for imperfect english, let me know, I'll set them straight.
This stereotypical attitude that we Americans have with regard to everyone else needing to speak english is lame. It's part of the reason we're looked down on internationally and it contributes to the decline of our society. People speaking english as a 2nd (3rd, 4th, etc.) language should be accepted as fit for conversation, regardless of accuracy.
I wish I could give you several thumbs up for that comment. Amen.
I've been trying to learn Chinese the last couple of years, and the more I do (and the more I sound like a brain-damaged chimp while I'm learning), the more I appreciate just how advanced the English of my foreign friends is. Besides, too many of we Americans don't even speak our one language very well.
"Brain damaged chimp" = your comments are smile inducing.
Tim, I really appreciate your comment and support. In Italy we have a funny quote that goes like this: "It's better to be quiet and give the impression of being stupid rather than saying something and confirming it" Jokes apart trying to add value to the conversation isn't always easy but i'm forcing myself to comment when i feel i have something to say and eventually i'll learn SEO and English at the same time :)
I need 462 points to be in the top 95 percent? I'm so close! I was fascinated with this post and these stats, thanks chenry.
I guess I can't speak for others, but I know that for myself, I go through phases on SEOmoz when I participate a ton, commenting on every post for a couple weeks, and then spend a month or two still reading but being pretty quiet. I'm hoping this means I like to listen more than talk, which I generally do. It's not that I'm getting anything less out of the entire site when I'm quiet.
Still the stats lead one to believe that an overwhelming majority aren't using the site to its full potential and I can see why the mozzers would want to improve on this (though I can suspect that PRO sales are going pretty well).
I'm not sure where that number came from . . . by looking at the total number of users (currently 7187) and multiplying by 0.05 you get ~360. So if you're in the Top 360 SEOmoz users you are in the top 5% in my mind. Today #360 has 52 moz points, so if you have 52 or more moz points, you're in the 95th percentile.
Tim you are correct. For some reason I was trying to use my old college stats class information, and used 2 times the standard deviation, which now that I look at it is not correct.
Apparently I didn't learn as much in that class as I thought! =)
Here's my two cents and it's probably a little bit different of an outlook due to only being on SEOmoz for a week or so.
First off great post. I think it's safe to say we all love statistics.
While not taking into consideration the statistics I think the number of comments on blog posts is very good, but number isn't the only important factor. I feel that even more important is the quality of the comments. Pretty much all comments I have read here are of very high quality, and this is pretty rare on most other sites.
It's much better to have 20 very intelligent comments rather then 100 "cool post dude!"
Just like the stats show, lurkers make up a high percentage of readers. This happens on forums as well. People are comment shy for a couple reasons, they are new-ish to SEO, like myself, and are a bit afraid of putting our opinion out there in case it's wrong. There's always the worry of the "know it all" coming in and being rude to them..and I'm not saying this happens here. I have yet to see this on SEOmoz.
Despite myself being new, I am trying to comment on blog posts because it add's to the whole experience of being a member on this site. I will try to put my comment-shyness to the side.
Well I guess I only had one reason as to why people don't comment. I figure this is getting long enough and 20 other people have probably already said pretty much the same thing.
I essentially agree with this. Why encourage more comment posting if it's only going to increase the signal/noise ratio? SEOMoz was always going to be a "take away" operation, in that users would visit it and take the information away for their purposes. The fact that it has the community it does is kind of unusual in the first place.I don't think you guys want to turn this into a message forum, since that usually leads to drama.
As for YouMoz contributors, it is a bit of a fork. Anyone who can consistently contribute telling, quality content to YouMoz could just as easily do so on their own blog. Heck, SEOMoz tells them how to do it! From a reward standpoint there's not a lot of incentive unless you want a job at SEOMoz or your content is tailored somehow to generate more business for yourself, in which case it probably wouldn't be approved anyway.
There are a bunch of comments here from readers who don't often comment and there's absolutely nothing wrong if you just sit back and read...
Although, I'm wondering if the incentives need to work both ways - for people who receive the votes, but also for those who do all the voting.
I've got no figures to back me up, and I could be completely wrong (so if this doesn't apply to you, please don' hate me)... but I wonder how many non-commenters bother to give thumbs-up when they read a good article or comment?
Maybe incentives should be introduced for those that enjoy the content but are too shy to vocally contribute.
Great post! My two cents are as follows:
How do you get more people to post? That's not really the key question. The real question is "How do you get people to post great stuff?".
I don't write something for YOUmoz (or indeed any other blog) unless I feel I've got something that's worth saying; that people need to hear. So when I do write something, I try and make sure it's awesome. I don't always succeed, but that's my motivation.
What you need to make YOUmoz more awesome, is only allow the awesome stuff through, and build a non-moz-members team, who want to post awesome stuff to YOUmoz, because they love it. New people can be added if they submit more than three awesome posts, and that way the mozzers don't need to filter it themselves. Build a community around it, and a team who'll ensure that every day there's something great on it, just like the main blog.
I think that the staff is quite successful at "only allowing awesome stuff" to be posted here, but what I think we all need to remember is that we can't discourage potential first-time posters with statements like "you can only be added if you submit more than three awesome posts." If someone writes ONE awesome post, it should end up on YOUmoz! What's the point in waiting to review two additional posts to ensure that they are consistently awesome? If they wrote one great post, they'll probably be able to do it again...
good work chenry!
I originally started commenting to try and attain that elusive 100 point milestone to acheive the no-follow. In time I've decided that I'm less interested in removing the no-follow and more interested in reading about all the YOUmoz tactics and strategies that are based on real-world activity; and giving support and insight where I can.
I'm not sure how many other people feel that way, but for me the points reward got me interacting and through the interactions helped change my mindset. Thanks for that.
I imagine a lot of SEOmozzers don't want to clutter your comments with meaningless great post comments. I find myself barely having enough time to read through all the blog feeds in my netvibes account in any given day; so I generally ignore comments unless I'm looking for some relevant information.
If you are looking for more particpation through I blog, I would suggest focusing on polling people, and asking opinions. Though due to the technically advanced nature of SEOmoz it might just be that most people are intimidated.
Maybe you should try to segment blogs posts to target different part of you readership and solicit more comments that way.
Shyness. Risk of a thumbs down.
Most of us would still be at the learning stage, rather than contributing stage, based on the rich content of youmoz posts.
We're happy to read each week. And looking for answers to questions.
If it was a chatty forum, where it felt ok to ask a question that some might think was dumb, I would participate more. I used to contribute a fair bit at webproworld, because it felt like I could help people who had started after me. Not here, though. It's a level higher.
I'd like to feel that I could ask more questions. And get more varied answers. I've only asked one so far. Even though it was a public question, I just got one answer, from Jane (thanks!). On the typical webmaster forum you'd get a bunch of people piping in with suggestions. It's a bit more fun that way. SEO should be fun. It's a creative battle to improve rankings. It's fun seeing what others do and what they suggest.
For example I'd love to know more advanced analytics info.
How to transform myself from an average Google Analytics user to a super user. How people are using Custom Reports. What they give to clients. What clients are asking for. What distinguishes an average analysis from a top flight analysis.
I read Avinash's blog on occasion.I've just bought the advanced SEO DVDs - can't wait for them to arrive.
Maybe it's the blog format - spaced out much further than a forum, you have to page down and down and down, rather than scanning quickly.
Maybe it's the time difference in Australia.
If there isn't a blog post on the topic I'm currently interested in, where do I go on SEOMOZ, to spark some casual fun discussion?
PS. I am happy with SEOMOZ - -glad I upgraded. But I don't feel part of it yet.
Awesome research, once again. Keep this up and you'll be in the top 5 in no time...
I'm not convinced being in the "top 95%" has any real value. I suppose I fit that category - I'm ranked #27. My interaction here, though, has fallen off greatly.
Still, it's hard to ignore the 1209 readers of YOUmoz. It's a unique audience, no doubt, but if you've got a message that fits, this is a great place to be heard.
My understanding of what YOUmoz means to SEOmoz is something of a "giving back to the community" project. It attracts interactive users, sure - some of whom will end up being PRO Members. Still, the main business model now is the membership. That much is clear. If YOUmoz was shut down entirely I don't see that it would sway SEOmoz off their main business course.
They're kicking ass developing tools and putting out great blog content and guides. I'm not sure YOUmoz is an integral part of that - so even if they don't find a way to expand it and get more people involved, maybe that's not the end of the world...
Great post. :) And like others have said, you'll be in the top 100 in no time with great information like this.
SEOmoz Staff/Associates have earned over 25% of the 153,262 points in the SEOmoz world.
I think this is a big praise to SEOmoz. Think about it for a second. Other people, non-paid people, good hearted marketers decided to contribute 75% of the moz points.
But, a sobering stat, brings some balance.
The top 1.5% of SEOmoz user has earned over 62% of the total SEOmoz points.
Although it might be a few marketers, still, it's a praise to SEOmoz for bringing the community to contribute. Many big names have posted here.
Yea, they can improve, but hell, I think they are doing an amazing job and get an 'A' for their work. But, like a smart business, they want to get an A+ at every test, even when people change the questions on the test at the last minute. ;) [What? I didn't know linkscape would be on the test] *Fyi, for those gossip spreaders, the last sentence is just a point to say "Moz has had a few tough curve balls, that were impossible/difficult to predict".
One last FYI, I'm not trying to be a kiss-ass. I just think a lot of people in the community like to criticize but I don't see them making anything close to YOUmoz, MozTools, Linkscape, or anything close to it. I just think some people should eat my shoe and stop starting petty fights.
So, good luck Moz on trying to get that "+" on your report card.
Nicely done. I'm a numbers guy so I loved the stats although I do agree with one of those who left an earlier comment that some people would maybe better appreciate the great data you present if you had presented it also in some kind of visual form like a chart or graph. Either way, very nice job.
I tried to create some graphs from the data but when you have over 7100 members and a point spread from 20,000 to -79, it creates a graph that doesn't mean much. I'll keep trying different things though.
Not a Pro member here, just an old timer who tends to stray away for extended periods of time but always returns sooner or later :-) hence 37 so kinda close to the top :D
Ahh the good old days when the sh#t hit the fan at SEO Chat and we all moved here to talk ;-)
I think people like to take and not give or they are too lazy :)
Even i was lazy first and just kept on reding but i have started commenting now .I fell this also helps to remember the points you learned in the article much much more.
I usually only comment when I feel like I can add something (some seo knowledge) to the ongoing converstaion. Most of the time I only like to read good content, therefore i only post if I have good content to contribute. Im not sure whats better, good content or "lots of user participation". Both have their pros and cons.
I reckon that the usual pattern is that early comments on a post are more likely to be thumbed up/down. Later ones tend not to be (although there's the odd exception).
Presumably this is because commited SEOmoz users, who are more likely to thumb up/down, read new posts early, and so miss later comments.
So if you want a thumb up, post a comment early. Not much hope for this one then ...!
I always come back to all the older posts to see what comments have been made. If it's been more than a week, I usually won't go back unless I think it's something worth going back for.
I think that because this blog audience consists of mostly of SEO professionals and because this blog is the authority on the subject... some interesting things occur:
To get people involved...
By the way I think SEOmoz is great at doing all these things, but there's always room for improvement.
Very interesting post...I think those statistics will definitely help motivate all the users who haven't partipated as much me included
where were you able to pull this data from?
im intersted in looking at types of posts and how many comments / thumbs they generate
Neo,
I created a small spider that crawled and scraped the data from the SEOmoz site.
Hi Chenry, Great statistics here. Some points were really so amazing to me. You have made a significant research about the moz points here.
Thanks for sharing the results.
1. More tutorials and entry level topics would increase my participation in the blog, but I'm not really the target demographic (SEOnewb)
2. I think increased participation in the blog will generate an increase in Pro-Members. The more they get, the more they want.
3. Too many posts and comments make it overwhelming for the users too. I've come here to read a post at it's early stage and there are dozens of comments already - mostly saying what I wanted to say (and better)
4. See #3
Technorati just posted a relevant article about this probelm
https://www.techcrunch.com/2009/03/10/are-blogs-losing-their-authority-to-the-statusphere/
Take care of your top users is what I would take away from this..
I've got to admit, my contribution on here has been pretty much non existent compared to my activity on other sites/blogs and social media streams. I'm not really sure why as I am a regular reader of SEOmoz and am subscribed to the RSS feed.
However, after reading this article, this kinda encourages me to comment/contribute more which I will aim to do, I have very little spare time to reply on all blogs I read but I'm definately going to try and boost my MozPoints now, hah. :)
Right, that's my profile updated so that's a good start. Been meaning to do that for ages, heh
I admit that I am new to SEO. I came to the site to learn what the pros are doing. I have become a daily reader and contribute when I can. I can only agree with dbsinteractive.
I had wondered how the points worked myself.
I know one of the reasons I don't contribute more is that I am really new at all of this, so I figure that it's best to sit in the background unless something really catches my eye. If I have questions I tend to just search out answers myself, and I feel that I'm not nearly at a level in which I can contribute, outside of saying something like high SERPs are good, which I figure we all already know (okay, I'm a little better than that, but not by much). I do plan on contributing more as I gain more knowledge, and feel that I have more to say, be it right or wrong (sometimes people learn more from being wrong than from being right ;) ).
All very interesting, I don't quite know how chenry has managed the points he has in such a short space of time, I've been here as long and thought I was doing well with my 150! Perhaps some tips ;)
Yoshimi,
I try to read and post my 2 cents on everything that I have a little knowledge on. Granted their are lots of topics I don't know anything on and then I just read. =) It's helps to have a sence of humor too.
I'm new to seomoz, but as it was mainly a blog for me, I didn't even realize that I could have an account... Done !
I know that most of the blogs I follow, I lurk and absorb rather than engage in convesation. That said, I am already an active commenter on seomoz because once I started to interact, I couldn't stop.
In fact, I anectodotally noticed earlier this week that you did not need to interact a lot to move quickly up the rankings.
It would be interesting to know how many YouMoz articles are submitted daily/weekly.
Look forward to continuing to read and comment. I'm, not sure further incentives would encourage me more. Wouldn't it be like those social networkers that collect tens of thousands of followers/friends.
I am new here and to the seo world. I don't post comments because most of the time i'm not understanding what the author is talking about! I spend most of my time reading and trying to re-read what i just read. The video posts r very helpful. Also, i like the whiteboard friday post. Its a video. I do agree that somekind of incentive would boost traffic.
From my experience, 12.3% of users posting 10 or more comments is pretty good on a site that isn't strongly blog or forum-centric. I would expect the vast majority of seomoz visitors to passively absorb content rather than contribute, particularly as the site has a niche subject matter. If your numbers include RSS feed views, that may also skew your statistics towards non-contribution.From a site owner's pont of view, I wouldn't recommend creating too many incentives for posting, as you still want your users to post because they have something to contribute. Making posting too appealing can potentially reduce the quality of your comments or other user-generated content as people start to value quantity over quality.
Thanks for the post chenry, personnaly I don't comment because I think that I have nothing interesting to say, I am just a little french SEO :D and also, my english is horrible :)
I'd like to see how many viewers for each post.
One website I visit has a "flaming" file folders icon to show it's a hot topic. It lists viewers, the number of replies (could be comments in this case), etc.
How many Moz members are small business owners like me who are here to learn and/or to find good seo professionals when we need them?
The truth is that maybe we dont comment so often and earn MozPoints but we all read SEOmoz Blog and earn SEOpoints!
It is several monthes that I am a member of SEOmoz and read most blog posts, but I dont comment always. But SEOmoz always have great stuff here, and they must keep it moving and dont think about the comments. Do not forget that content is king. If you have a useful content your community will grow. Comments mustnt be a criteria. Because most of SEOmoz readers are smart people, and most of them think that they can do something useful instead of writing a comment and earn Mozpoints (it is really too hard to earn 100 points, because when you stop commenting points are starting to decrease).
Anyway, I think that it is not a big problem as you described.
OK you've brought me out of lurk mode :)
I want to agree with some of the points already made. First, the comment quality here is so overwhelmingly good, in terms of info, informed debate, and friendly conversation that SEOmoz should be very proud.
Also, I agree that not everyone is a writer. It's easy for bloggers to forget that. They want everyone to join in, because they like to communicate through the written word. Not everyone can do it so easily.
I'll add something else though - while our firm does SEO, it is not our only core business. We are an overall web company. We sell SEO services whenever we can, and we build best SEO practices into every site we build, but lots of clients don't want to spend extra money on the advanced search stuff or think they can do it themselves. So we're usually busy just building websites, and I come here from time to time to stay updated and see what's new in the world of search.
Great food for thought - I always love stats. One thing I think is a little tricky, though, is that these stats are all internal. It's hard to compare participation on SEOmoz to other communities, forums, etc. Personally, I find that a lot of forums have many more "lurkers" than participants, and the active participants account for most of the activity (80/20 rule at work, once again). Personally, for every forum or site I participate heavily in, there are 20+ that I only read occasionally and rarely comment on - that's just a fact of internet life.
I may be biased, but my own sense is that participation on SEOmoz is more diverse than average. Anecdotally, I know that many of the top contributors when I first joined are no longer around much. That's sad, in some ways, buit it also means that the community naturally refreshes itself and isn't dominated by just a few people (including myself). It's always great to see new faces on YOUmoz, too. YOUmoz certainly could be improved, and it's great that we're having that conversation, but most sites I've been to don't have anything like it - user participation is limited to comments at best.
Offline, I've found this same phenomenon in professional associations and groups. A technology group I belong to has probably 1000+ members, but when I go to events, I see the same 100 people or so, and there are 10-20 people that I see all the time. Not coincidentally, those people not only put the most into the organization, in terms of time and commitment, but they get the most out of it as well. I think you'll find that pattern in many, many aspects of life.
Some form of the pareto principle applies to all things in life - including group dynamics.
Very interesting post.
I often consider commenting, but I usually find that whatever I was about to say has already been said by somebody else (and usually more eloquently at that). If there are other people like me, then that may explain some of the lack of participation.
Cool post, I think it goes to prove a lot more about the human psyche, I have been doing work on topics like this for quite a few clients across different markets and nearly all the results have proved on point especially for north americans....
I think as we start seeing more relevant branded communities and interaction online each one of us will infact be a part of the uber efficient algo / AI that the engines come out with in the years and decades to come.... Welcome to the matrix everyone or the collective.....
Keep up the good work,
An interesting suggestion that I may make to everyone, listen to the audio book by Stephen Hawkings "The universe in a Nutshell" while working on your next seo project.
The book can be a dry read for those that dont have a math background, but the audio book makes it quite easy, and honestly makes my SEO efforts more interesting somehow, perspective perhaps...
Regards from Vancouver :-)
Great data. It just fits in so perfectly with what I tell people about the web and active members. 10% of the population does 90% of the work and of that 90% there is a 1% group that does 50% of that. But in so many respects this is simple the nature of people. Now these numbers don't line up exactly with the loose numbers I'm throwing out above, but it's a pretty common issue across the web and other aspects in general. How do you fix that... I don't know? There will just always be those that watch and they will consume most of your audience. The trick is to be a active leader and contribute because there are always more followers than leaders.